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How do you store your data/backups? Anonymous 07/20/2017 (Thu) 23:19:37 [Preview] No. 10460
Hie, I'm trying to find a good solution to never get out of storage on my HDDs, for my backups and my regular use.
What is your data storage solution?
I want, if possible, a solution that is the most freedom compliant.
There is the usb HDDs, 3/4 plugged on a rasp.
There is the NAS with 3.5' HDDs in it.
Maybe a cheap 20$ computer with the HDDs in it with linux installed...

What should be the best? What HDD to buy (there are these backdoors, even though I don't think I can find any without)

Thanks you!

Anonymous 07/20/2017 (Thu) 23:29:11 [Preview] No. 10461 del
I just use external usb drives for "cold" data storage, but I have encrypted password files on floppies that get refreshed/replaced from time to time(multiple, for redundancy). I have an old pentium 3 era machine I will probably end up putting sata drives in (with IDE adapters of course) for intermediate storage so I dont have to worry too much about backdoored hardware.

Honestly I have never heard of backdoors in hard drives, but then again anything with firmware is vulnerable.

Anonymous 07/21/2017 (Fri) 09:55:56 [Preview] No. 10463 del
> What should be the best? What HDD to buy (there are these backdoors, even though I don't think I can find any without)
GPG encrypt your stuff and put it anywhere.

Anonymous 07/21/2017 (Fri) 21:19:09 [Preview] No. 10468 del

Encryption is not the problem, but what to buy, what to actually build. I'm tired of all the overpriced or hidden ads bullshit on the clear.

Anonymous 07/27/2017 (Thu) 06:34:38 [Preview] No. 10493 del
Magnetic data (tapes) - Up to 10 years
Nintendo cartridge - 10-20 years
Floppy disk - 10-20 years
CDs and DVDs - 5-10 unrecorded, 2-5 recorded
Blu-Ray - Not certain, probably over 2-5 recorded
M-Disc - 1,000 years (theoretically)
Hard disk - 3-5 years
Flash storage - 5-10 years or more (depends on write cycles)

I would buy a few gold archival DVD-R that supposedly lasts 100 years to keep some shit in that, while buying the same bare HDDs and a docking station. Always remember, a "backup" of a backup is a true backup. A backup is not necessarily archival. Redundancy is key. The data for your OS is like a workshop table, and the programs installed on it is the tools. The stuff you make on that table is not stored on the table but is stored elsewhere. Have multiple tables and the end product in separate redundant archives.

Anonymous 07/29/2017 (Sat) 17:20:57 [Preview] No. 10501 del
Not OP but if i were to completely fill up an HDD and just leave it there and once in a month turn it on to copy stuff from it to another place, how much would the HDD last? Shouldn't it last for quite a long time?

Anonymous 08/03/2017 (Thu) 00:50:06 [Preview] No. 10539 del
This is so wrong.

Anonymous 08/04/2017 (Fri) 15:34:19 [Preview] No. 10544 del
Define "quite a long time". Statistical data and theoretical speculation are two separate concepts with different variables and outcomes, while they're both aren't the same as individual cases. Therefore, the following is only an opinion based on both statistical data and theoretical speculation as well as personal experience, but is not "fact".

I had an 8 year old flash drive with some good shit on it, it simply died on me despite taking real good care of it (so much for the "cold" data storage theory). I had taken out a HDD from a 2005 Toshiba laptop some time around 2014 or so since the CPA office I worked in were getting newer shit. I then installed Trisquel on it, shit still works like nothing happened to this day. I live in an environment that's on average 80% humid in any given day. I assume that if you have a temperature controlled room, never have power outages or compensate with battery backup surge protectors just in case you do deal with power outages from time to time, and keep the write cycles very low as possible, you would extend the lifespan of your HDD, though if you're using NTFS, fragmentation just might become an issue. If you're using Windows and/or Macs, they'll probably leave stupid index files. The more data there in say an 8 TB HDD, the more as time goes by, something might get corrupted by the sands of time through magnetic depolarization even by a bit or two. The platters is where the data is stored, so if either the SATA bridge or the moving parts (spindle and actuator), one could still recover the data. That being said, I've heard about lots of crap about Seagate external HDDs and some Western Digital external HDDs dying on them within a year though I suspect that it's anything but the platters. Assuming your HDD model isn't a reportedly statistically inferior product from an manufacturing flaw, I can only be confident enough to say that the original HDD would probably last at least 7 years, within average variables, but the data saved onto other storage mediums differ, it's pseudo immortal assuming that there's always someone alive at any given moment would pass on the data to newer, fresher, more reliable and trustworthy publicly available consumer level data storage mediums which are inherently inferior to what governments might use like sapphire optical discs. CD, DVD, Blu-Ray readers aren't going to disappear any time soon.

Here's the source behind the numbers https://www.storagecraft.com/blog/data-storage-lifespan/

What am I wrong about? Perhaps you haven't really thought about data preservation and various other implications behind it. HDDs aren't going anywhere until SSDs become more reliable and cheaper than HDDs. Ironic isn't it, SSDs aren't really reliable despite how HDDs got more parts to break. A giant magnet won't immediately destroy the data on the coated glass platters, only the ceramic magnet and the moving parts are immediately affected by the magnetic force, doing shit it shouldn't normally do. Having less moving parts is of course better, but that doesn't mean that data won't disappear. Heat destroys data regardless if it's an HDD or SSD. Some laptops get super hot despite using SSDs because the other components still use lots of energy. Some speculate however, that HDDs might be better than SSDs when it comes to heat. https://blog.korelogic.com/blog/2015/03/24#ssds-evidence-storage-issues Yes, the case can and has been made that SSD lifespan might be shorter than HDD lifespan. In short, there's more to data storage than you might be willing to acknowledge. SSDs might be perfect for criminals that want to have their data naturally wiped within a shorter time than HDDs.

Anonymous 08/05/2017 (Sat) 12:55:38 [Preview] No. 10569 del

Thanks you a lot for your help (a little bite late). The HDD docking station is exactly what I was looking for.
I'll go for the gold DVD-R for my important info, and the HDD for the rest.

Should I rewrite on my backup my data, like every year to make it live longer?


Anonymous 08/06/2017 (Sun) 01:25:07 [Preview] No. 10571 del
To make what last longer? Flash drives and SSDs need to be plugged into an active computer to get enough energy to store energy itself to reduce potential data loss as frequently as possible, like say twice a week or more, perhaps at least once everyday. If you meant HDDs, well I'll be very cautious in every odd numbered year after its manufacturing date, even the first year if you bought those cheap external HDDs. All HDDs are vulnerable around 3~7 years from just natural magnetic depolarization (also caused by heat) regardless of how you minimize write cycles significantly, so I would make sure to backup the backup at least before it reaches 5 years of age, as well as backing up the backed up backup. Any HDD 5 years and older are like a ticking time bomb with a randomly selected future detonation date. Also, store your data in multiple physical locations that you can go to. It's riskier to rely on friends and family to hold them.

Concerning checking the health of your HDDs with a program, it doesn't take into consideration the physical environment of the HDD despite if it thinks the HDD has no bad sectors, not really fragmented, and have plenty of write cycles left.

Heat/infrared is merely low energy light, and light is electricity. Heat still manages to affect electronics because electricity can affect atoms. Same concept for microwaves, radio waves, etc., they're all within the spectrum of light and so has varying levels of electricity that affects the electron shells even slightly, and so contributes to breaking bonds. I still wouldn't leave HDDs on top of routers, near cell phones, etc. Physical data is pseudo immortal as long as there's higher sentient life that can interpret and preserve it. If humans all die out, and if the aliens can't decode the remains of human technology, all is lost. Clay tablets outlasted thousands of years of civilization. Perhaps consider investing in some clay, chisel out a football with a dickbutt logo and bury some in the desert.

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 00:52:53 [Preview] No. 10730 del
>How do you store your data/backups?
On paper.

I am not joking.

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 02:11:41 [Preview] No. 10733 del
>Hard disk - 3-5 years
>CDs and DVDs - 5-10 unrecorded, 2-5 recorded
In my experience, hard disks *used for cold storage* last at least x2 if not x3, while properly stored CD/DVDs simply won't fail ever. You should question yourself how much are going to spin these discs and how are you handling and storing them. Realistically speaking.

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 02:48:44 [Preview] No. 10734 del
>cold storage
>properly stored
You do realize that not even 9 out of 10 people do this nor understand at all as to what you mean?

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 04:28:47 [Preview] No. 10737 del
(50.66 KB 468x320 Data.png)
I have conceived an idea for data storage that would allow massive amounts of data to be stored on almost any medium and could be moved into real life in the form of a paper.

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 12:36:29 [Preview] No. 10745 del
they could inform themselves I guess, no phd is required
I once had fun with paperback and similar stuff, but it's not just grossly inefficient: it simply won't last as long as a dvd unless you go through a laminating process. It's also a huge PITA to get the data back.

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 15:22:27 [Preview] No. 10750 del
You could use mathematical grid paper and use the squares to represent data. A black square has a value of 1 and a white square has a value of 0, run it through a scanner to turn the dots into data, and now you have stored data on a paper that can be extracted using a scanner. Get extremely small grid paper and use a high accuracy printer to fill in squares to store data.

May be inefficient and horrible at storing large amounts of data, but if laminated, you have durable and permanent data that stays good indefinitely.

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 16:56:09 [Preview] No. 10757 del
there is also similar projects with color

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 20:07:56 [Preview] No. 10762 del
Nice. I already hoard books and print web pages if they are extremely valuable. I have yet to build a laptop with a lead/faraday cage around it as a backup plan...

Anonymous 08/16/2017 (Wed) 20:14:03 [Preview] No. 10763 del
This isn't related to the discussion (possibly a little...), but I have an interesting hobby of mine when it comes to observation. I love to walk around in the wilderness (Wilderness being areas free of man-made objects or land that naturally occurs) and look for interesting animals or insects that I haven't seen before. I draw detailed pictures of the specimen and pursue it for a few hours to see how it acts and how it works. It is highly similar to Zoology and is much more effective than reading a book as actually observing real life phenomena and simulating your senses forms stronger and longer lasting memories.

Geology is also pretty fun, especially in desert areas (New mexico, Arizona, etc.)

Anonymous 08/17/2017 (Thu) 15:27:10 [Preview] No. 10795 del
It's really not too hard to farady cage your data, and you don't have to farady cage your whole computer. What I do is store all my important media/data offline in both DVD and flashdrive mediums, and faraday cage those backups. You can buy static-proof / RF-proof "faraday bags" online for pretty cheap, sometimes you need to double-nestle them to absolutely assure proper EMP prevention.

I also have an old big Creamtex container from a farm that acts as a proper faraday cage (yes, I've tested it out with radios and cell phones, they get no reception when being closed in the container). That I store a perfectly good laptop inside with Linux OS already installed, along with a bunch of other flashdrives and storage mediums to keep them protected.

If there were an EMP, sure my regular computer would be toast, but I'd have a backup laptop & mouse with all my important files double-nestled inside faraday baggies.

Anonymous 08/17/2017 (Thu) 15:38:00 [Preview] No. 10797 del

Another thing preppers look into is actually surviving an EMP, which your faraday cages do NOT provide a solution for. Extra food, extra water / filtration system, extra guns/ammo/mags/rem oil, extra matches/lighters, an alternative source of energy (must be EMP resistant), extra toilet paper / paper towels, extra sanitation products like soap and hand sanitizers, extra toothbrushes/toothpicks/floss... all the essentials would be nearly impossible to get in a crisis scenario such as an EMP event. Where you could get them, they would be heavily rationed and scarce too. After an EMP, there would be no mass transportion so stores would be dried out of supplies within days.

See this great prepping guide, all you need to know: https://archive.fo/dr3NH

Anonymous 08/17/2017 (Thu) 16:35:06 [Preview] No. 10799 del
(107.53 KB 474x249 rations-of-slavery.png)

If you don't have your electronic on, Is it still fried by the EMP?
I would like to keep a watch after an EMP, but I don't know how to protect it.

Anonymous 08/17/2017 (Thu) 20:03:04 [Preview] No. 10810 del
I keep five backup toughbooks inside of a plastic bag that has been heat sealed making it waterproof. I put the laptop inside of a faraday cage which in turn is inside of a metal box made of lead. Why five laptops you may ask? Well, that is if one of them breaks, I can move to another laptop and use that one instead, and if all of my laptops break, I can find the broken parts and use working parts from another to fix it.

Anonymous 09/07/2017 (Thu) 01:02:51 [Preview] No. 11036 del
Block of ice

Anonymous 11/01/2017 (Wed) 10:47:06 [Preview] No. 11640 del
I smear feces on the wall and write 0s & 1s

Anonymous 01/09/2018 (Tue) 12:46:44 [Preview] No.12176 del
Write code in stone

Anonymous 01/18/2018 (Thu) 12:27:54 [Preview] No.12222 del
I store them on the internet behind 7 proxies and I upload them with these gloves man.

thompson iphone 01/18/2018 (Thu) 17:10:30 [Preview] No.12228 del

"Get off my board man. You're too HOT! You're a hit, waiting to happen."

Anonymous 01/18/2018 (Thu) 23:00:24 [Preview] No.12234 del

Anonymous 01/21/2018 (Sun) 16:13:45 [Preview] No.12256 del
Good question OP. Just to clarify: a backup is not one copy of something, its multiple copies of something. The second you have only one copy of something, its no longer a backup.

I still use DVDs for most of my backups. Typically I use DVDs for media and other data or documentation. I also store the same files within flashdrives and external harddrives (which I have farday caged / shielded from electromagnetic interference or static shock).

Sometimes I'll have three copies of certain files depending if I still have those files on my normal computer. I also backup Operating Systems and have extra old laptops that I bought at used computer shops. This way, I'm pretty much set for life.

Anonymous 01/27/2018 (Sat) 20:03:26 [Preview] No.12298 del
Quick question:
Is there some kind of file system with scalable fault tolerance/precautions?
Lets say i want to store away 500MB on a DVD and i create an image that fills the whole 4.7GB of a DVD with various redundant blocks of that data, surrounded by check sums and whatnot, as much as i like (scalable).
I hope this way it will be more likely that you can read or recover that data after a long time and you have the convenience of a DVD storage.
A nice tool for easy reading/recovering would be helpful.

EMP thoughts:
Even if you had a box with 2m thick lead walls isolating your machine, if a cable for eg. power supply goes into that box, your machine might not be EMP save.

Anonymous 01/27/2018 (Sat) 20:42:36 [Preview] No.12299 del
You are confused. There's three questions on your reply: filesystems, DVD and EMP safety
>file system with scalable fault tolerance/precautions
>A nice tool for easy reading/recovering would be helpful.
I don't know, but optical storage has only one advantage today, that is, you don't need to trust the micro-controler firmware.
>if a cable for eg. power supply goes into that box, your machine might not be EMP save.
Wrong. The EMP would just stop the conduction of the electrons through the cable temporarily, not destroy the hadware itself (unless it's a pulse so high that the copper goes to melting point). Also, you don't need lead walls, unless you want radioactivity protection. A simple aluminium faraday cage would do the job just as well.

For backup I would say: if it's offline, do a RAID setup. If it's online, use Tahoe-LAFS and distribute the HDD's on different places.

Anonymous 01/29/2018 (Mon) 16:38:45 [Preview] No.12310 del
From what I understand most electronics are vulnerable to electromagnetic pulses. However they have to be hooked up to the grid and/or have battery power to be vulnerable and/or have some kind of active Wifi signal to be vulnerable.

Faraday cages are safe as long as the electonics are NOT hooked up/powered on in any way and are properly sealed within the conductive material so they are not physically touching their conductive surrounding. For example, if you were to Faraday cage a basic cell phone, you would need to remove the batteries from it and then wrap it up with a plastic bag or inside a little cardboard box and then put that into a conductive surrounding (such as an old trash can) and making sure the lid is closed tightly so that no RF/Wifi signal can interfere with that electronic device. Then you have properly faraday'd it.

If the electronic is old and has no battery, no wifi, and is not hooked up to the grid at all it should be safe even if it is not faraday caged. I can't see how an EMP would effect it if its completely off-grid and not activated. (IF I HAPPEN TO BE WRONG ABOUT THAT, CORRECT ME PLEASE!)

Anonymous 02/01/2018 (Thu) 08:51:55 [Preview] No.12331 del
My solution is to avoid having lots of data to worry about. I can pretty much fit everything on a 500 GB USB/portable hard disk. I recently bought another such disk since my backup drive is from 2009, so I'm going to copy all files to new drive. I also backup the most critical things onto CDR. These CDs are marked by date, so it functions like a historical archive.

Anonymous 02/01/2018 (Thu) 09:18:00 [Preview] No.12332 del
You don't need any special filesystem. Use PAR2 to create the redundant data.
By default, it only creates 5% redundancy, but you can set it to 100% if you have room.
If you use this in conjunction with bzip2 and small block sizes, you should be able to recover from almost any error. Or just avoid compression altogether, if you have the room. Of course, many files like images and videos are already compressed, so can't do much about that short of dealing only with lossless formats (I mean the originals, not by stupidly converting MP3 to FLAC or whatever).

Anonymous 11/22/2018 (Thu) 19:54:52 [Preview] No.13000 del
In a usb

Anonymous 11/22/2018 (Thu) 22:38:19 [Preview] No.13001 del
Get MDiscs for long term storage and DVDs for your monthly back ups.

Use an encrypted tarball for your / dir. When you want to restore your files, navigate to it/copy it over and extract the tarball using the below commands. In this scenario however, if you cannot boot into your OS for whatever reason, I recommend having your private key and public key backed up on a DVD or MDisc. Then it's only a matter of reimporting and trusting your keys and running the commands like usual. Here's an idea.

# on your pc in a backup_this_computer.sh script or whatever:
timestamp=$(date +%m%d%y); #MMDDYY
tar -cjv / --one-file-system | gpg -e -r your@emailforthekey | ssh someuser@someserver "( cat > /somebackupdirectorysomewhere/hostnhostn_$timestamp.backup )";

# The above script will just pipe over the zipped and encrypted bytes over the network to a server and puke it out into a file there.


# When you want to restore your backup...

gpg -dr somekey@whatever MMDDYY_hostname.backup | tar vxpj -C /

# This will unzip and recreate all of your folders.

I might've made some mistakes because I am doing this off the top of my head, however this should work. If you wish to forego encryption of your backups, simply remove the gpg steps. That way it will consist of an archive only. Hope this helps.

Anonymous 11/22/2018 (Thu) 22:40:45 [Preview] No.13002 del
Oh fuck syntax error, the hostnhostn part should just be $hostn. IDK what happened there... hm...

Anonymous 11/25/2018 (Sun) 01:54:28 [Preview] No.13004 del
Uni gave me unlimited storage on google drive. Should I encrypt my shit and upload it there?

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