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ideas for saving /tech/ general Anonymous 10/16/2017 (Mon) 07:26:55 [Preview] No. 11561
We're about halfway through October and about two weeks out from our most esteemed /tech/nician's autistic tantrum over on /operate/:

>>>/operate/7122 it's good reading, he came in with a balloon knot and left with a rectum that you could park a utility van in

so it seems like a good time to reassess the state of the board.

Since October 1st, there have been 0.6 original posts per day on /tech/. I use the term "original" with some reservation, as some of them are just verbatim reposts from 8/tech/. There have been an average of 8.13 replies per day, but most of them were one-line comments or barbs without substance, or memes, or corrections to a previous post. We're averaging about 1 substantive reply per day. Two on a good day. I didn't feel like digging into the numbers any further, but it's my impression that these averages don't even reflect how dire the situation is, as there was a burst of activity at the beginning of the month that has tapered off significantly.

/tech/ is not dead, but it's on life support, and, ironically, none of its denizens seems to know how to service the life support machine.

It would be a shame for this alternative to pigchan and Hiroshima's /g/ to wither through neglect.

Let's brainstorm ideas for keeping this place alive.


Anonymous 10/16/2017 (Mon) 07:42:29 [Preview] No. 11562 del
>>11561
let's import users from the Rust community
I have already sent emails to 500 RiseUp accounts

I might also wean myself off pleb and 4cuck once switch machines


Anonymous 10/16/2017 (Mon) 15:23:30 [Preview] No. 11563 del
most people would rather live in the world where proprietary software is ubiquitous and commercialism is in vogue

we should focus on quality of posts and not volume necessarily


Anonymous 10/16/2017 (Mon) 16:25:44 [Preview] No. 11564 del
More content is needed to spark more discussion. I think we already have some quality posting autists here, what we need are relevant things to discuss. What we really need are some immigrants to bump our levels and help generate content.

I think our best option is to make releases of something to draw users here. The releases would be best distributed via torrent sites with included readmes' pointing here and links disseminated on tech related boards. The question is, a release of what? It could be portables, infographics, mods, lots of options really we just need to decide on something.


Anonymous 10/17/2017 (Tue) 09:21:21 [Preview] No. 11570 del
>>11562
>let's import users from the Rust community
>I have already sent emails to 500 RiseUp accounts
top kek, as they say

>>11563
>we should focus on quality of posts and not volume necessarily
Agreed. And I wouldn't have said anything if those few threads/replies we've had recently had been decent, on balance.

Unfortunately, they were utter shit.

>>11564
>More content is needed to spark more discussion.
>I think our best option is to make releases of something to draw users here.
Be the change you want to see in the world.


Anonymous 10/21/2017 (Sat) 01:12:13 [Preview] No. 11582 del


Anonymous 10/21/2017 (Sat) 01:20:48 [Preview] No. 11583 del
(227.22 KB 450x777 didnt.jpg)


Anonymous 10/22/2017 (Sun) 20:57:33 [Preview] No. 11596 del
Mandatory OS flags derived from the user agent in HTTP header.


Anonymous 10/23/2017 (Mon) 03:43:54 [Preview] No. 11597 del


Anonymous 10/24/2017 (Tue) 23:29:05 [Preview] No. 11600 del
>>11564
I'm up for organizing anything if there's some people interested.


Anonymous 10/24/2017 (Tue) 23:44:24 [Preview] No. 11602 del
>>11600
Personally up for; I'll lead you all to the promised land if you get me some warm/ semi-warm but medicated bodies.


Anonymous 10/25/2017 (Wed) 23:16:27 [Preview] No. 11604 del
>>11596
Tor = Windows NT 6.1


Anonymous 10/28/2017 (Sat) 12:33:40 [Preview] No. 11606 del
>>11604
Tor relays are public, it's arbitrary to run a check on IP address


Anonymous 10/28/2017 (Sat) 19:04:02 [Preview] No. 11607 del
I think you mean "easy", and yep, you'd need to do that unless you didn't care about locking out tor users.


Anonymous 10/28/2017 (Sat) 19:36:35 [Preview] No. 11608 del
>>11596
You could also deject the visitors user agent with javascript and block windows users.


Anonymous 10/31/2017 (Tue) 15:42:34 [Preview] No. 11634 del
(13.00 KB 494x126 javascript.png)


Anonymous 10/31/2017 (Tue) 15:59:34 [Preview] No. 11635 del
(169.43 KB 872x480 thats not true.webm)
>>11634
That's not true.


Anonymous 10/31/2017 (Tue) 21:46:52 [Preview] No. 11636 del
Yah, it is. You don't know what's in an email attachment even if if it's from someone you know. A bot might've guessed their password and the attachment contains a virus. You have to rely on your own pattern recognition to see whether the email looks "funny" or not. You don't know what's in Javascript when you visit a website. Many of them deliver 3rd party advertising Javascript and *they* don't even know what the fuck is in it. Web servers can get broken into and have their Javascript replaced. Skeezy advertisers can contract with the likes of Yahoo and give them straight-up botnet client installers to run. That's happened twice to yahoo alone.

So yes, it's true. Running with Javascript enabled in a web browser is executing unknown, untrusted client-side software that can do all sorts of nasty stuff, which is like clicking on every email attachment you get. Happy surfing.


Anonymous 10/31/2017 (Tue) 21:54:10 [Preview] No. 11637 del
>>11604
Tor is either local gateway or predefined set of exit nodes with Linux TCP frame.

>>11608
Block all windows users by detecting their fonts, all tor users whose window isn't 1000x1000 and those who has javascript on.

>>11636
Attackers can exploit your browser/mail reader even without attachments, just with simple html/css. What's next, you'll read all email in mutt?
How about mark all unencrypted or unsigned mails as spam? If your contacts are so bad at keeping their private pgp keys secure, there is nothing wrong with ditching them.


Anonymous 10/31/2017 (Tue) 22:52:04 [Preview] No. 11638 del
>>11637
>mutt?

Alpine.


Anonymous 11/01/2017 (Wed) 07:33:05 [Preview] No. 11639 del
pine here. the javascript poster's basically right: nobody who cares about security enables javascript. it's inconvenient, sure, like using secure passwords on things.


Anonymous 11/02/2017 (Thu) 21:30:35 [Preview] No. 11647 del
https://github.com/diafygi/webrtc-ips

kkziqd7btnjeiqpb.onion is a demo

nothing too surprising here, but a couple interesting code snippets


Anonymous 11/03/2017 (Fri) 12:55:30 [Preview] No. 11650 del
(163.15 KB 1080x1078 additional hope gone.jpg)
I honestly don't think we can keep chans alive for much longer. Everything is becoming heavily centralized and they're winning. People actually get quite perturbed if you even suggest for a moment that they should maybe spend less time on those mega sites.

We are fucked. The thing that made communities enjoyable was that there were so many people to talk to. Now they're herded up and told to consume. I won't lie, I bet they have plenty of information on me as well. I would hope their wageslaves are doing their job accordingly after all.


Anonymous 11/03/2017 (Fri) 16:08:49 [Preview] No. 11651 del
>>11650
>I honestly don't think we can keep chans alive for much longer.
If things keep going the way they are going now, this culture will surely die. I think the main problem is increased amount of negativity in general. Go to 8ch /tech/ and try reading first few threads. Almost all posts are negative in nature. Posts with positive thoughts are really hard to come by and if you happen to find one, there is always someone responding with "what a faggot" or with some other negative comment. I've kept going back there, thinking "maybe it's just this time of year again", but this is now the new normal. I don't know what's wrong with people that they are incapable of sharing positive thoughts. Constantly reading "kys" is really tiring.

Solution to this problem is similar to TV and the news problem. In the same way as you hopefully stopped watching news, you should now stop posting negative content. Stop with posts about what SJWs are doing in software, stop posting politics, stop calling anons faggots unless you have a very good reason to do so, don't tell people to "kys", tell them to change instead, don't post about privacy issues of software if you don't use it, discuss about alternatives instead... Why would people come here if all they get is complaining and negativity? One thing to keep in mind is, that going towards the other extreme can be equally as harmful. If something sucks, you should point it out in a constructive manner. We don't want to create a hugbox here, as that can be dangerous as well.

In order to initialize shift towards more positive environment, I will create a thread about electronics, as some anons have shown interest in circuits, soldering and hardware.


Anonymous 11/03/2017 (Fri) 16:53:28 [Preview] No. 11653 del
>>11651
> I think the main problem is increased amount of negativity

That's retarded. The main problem is that imageboards are full of people using them as social media and dramafagging, so negativity spirals into unconstructive butthurt instead of adding shitspewing to your posts without sacrificing the elementary and thoughtful content. It can only be fueled by negativity, but not when a hundred separate people want to post the same asinine shit without reading the thread, simply because they want to add their name to the list of ass-kissers or worse yet because that's all they know from already having come straight from facebook or reddit.

The problem is decreased amount of not being a faggot.


Anonymous 11/03/2017 (Fri) 19:27:19 [Preview] No. 11656 del
>>11653
I hate to say it but you're the person he's talking about. While I agree with you (hacker news-like asskissing devolves into... well Hacker News) he's not completely wrong. The main thing is politics. You guys definitely remember when chans weren't filled with brainwashed edgy /pol/ fags in every fucking thread right? It was fantastic. Politics really DO ruin any semblence of rational discussion. I don't mean to say that they shouldn't be able to speak their mind at all - that would be disgusting censorship after all - but it does indeed get tiring when every thread turns into a shit flinging contest about muh sjws and muh rust politik.

So to reiterate, I think the problem is most certainly a mix of absolute faggotry and political discussion where it honestly wasn't even warranted.


Anonymous 11/03/2017 (Fri) 22:16:15 [Preview] No. 11658 del
>>11653
I had the same thought some time ago. It's always easier to criticise than to do. I had the idea of making a board to be an anti negativity experiment to see the effects of enjoyment based posting. /gf turned out to be highly unsuccessful. The chans currently only serve one major niche, they offer the free speech and anonymity to openly shit on others without repercussion. A community needs to be more than that but they tend to already source everything else from one of the major sites like reddit.


Anonymous 11/03/2017 (Fri) 22:46:10 [Preview] No. 11659 del
I know for me one of the problems is being afraid to be wrong. I saw a thread about someone wanting to learn code and I also feel the same way about knowing where to start. I liked this post >>11630 because now I have a way to get my feet wet and not waste a lot of effort and time. So some humility in this time of technological calipers measuring everything can't hurt.


Anonymous 11/03/2017 (Fri) 23:28:11 [Preview] No. 11663 del
>>11659
That's one of the worst things anon. We are all wrong at one point but it's fucking pointless. Just get over that hurtle. >>11630 is not joking, the rush you get when your program works is beyond words. I've taken a lot of drugs but nothing comes close to seeing the thing you made with your bare hands walk for the first time. It's awesome.


Anonymous 11/05/2017 (Sun) 21:37:42 [Preview] No. 11671 del
(192.50 KB 830x1600 endor.jpg)


Anonymous 11/05/2017 (Sun) 23:57:06 [Preview] No. 11672 del
(233.68 KB 500x583 I am become death.png)
>>11671
What is this?


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 00:50:56 [Preview] No. 11674 del
It is a reference to the post being referenced by the two posters previous and an attempt to draw a corollary between one of the major motivators for programmers and one of the major motivators for posters. It is in agreement with those who believe that positive reactions are a component of keeping a board alive.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 01:27:56 [Preview] No. 11675 del
>>11674
I get that part from the context but I was referring to the source really.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 02:05:25 [Preview] No. 11677 del
>>11651
I agree with this. If anyone wants a good example of "chill" boards, I think fullchan's /hikki/ is still relatively non-toxic. This thread and the sticky of resources on fullchan's /prog/ are very civilized. It gets tiring after a while of seeing nonsense like /pol/ (and moe) constantly coming in with their ugly personalities only to cause a fuss.

And then >>11653. You'd do well to chill out. You're angry and it's like a throwing a stick of dynamite in a closely-laid mine field and it chain reacts. What you post affects other people, even if you don't recognize that the text from these rectangles is coming from real people, your words have a really real effect. You wouldn't go yelling obscenities and telling people to kill themselves in public (or maybe you would, in that case there are different problems that need addressing), because you would cause a very real and serious disturbance, so why would you do it here? I think many people don't have healthy outlets for their dissatisfaction and other negative emotions, and then treat these anonymous image boards like venting grounds under the banner of "free speech," "it was always like this." Maybe, but it got us to where we are today and that isn't a good place.

I don't know how this problem can be avoided. Imageboards rise and fall, along with their communities. Or atleast what could be considered a community, considering the doors are wide open for anyone to come in and start trouble with little repercussion or anything stopping them. I have some experience with online communities, mostly forums and video games, but I've seen which ones descend into madness and fizzle out, and which ones live long enough to be stable (albeit low population). The main problem for the aforementioned has been leadership. Weak and unwilling to take a stance of what their community is "about" and removing everyone who isn't a "cultural fit" and can get along. The ones that have survived keep a tight ship and aren't hesitant to ban those that won't ever be a functioning part of the community. Now, I don't recommend censoring posts as that causes more trouble than it's worth, but there is nothing wrong with banning people from posting if they don't contribute anything. It's harder with image boards because not only can the bans be easily circumvented, but that's usually what's been done. Panic bunkers, where new accounts from a certain date cannot post are common, but I don't see how that could be put into place without severe violations of privacy.

It is a difficult issue that has yet to be solved, contrary to some posters insistence that their way is the right way without any first hand evidence of their experiments working. Forums have already proven to be safe from invaders and that their way works for a while until the community inevitably fizzles out naturally, but not image boards that I know of have had any success in keeping a community. I'm sure there are some very obscure chans with a handful of dedicated posters and a tight-knit community, but I don't know of any.

I guess in the end it's up to the moderators and BOs to do their jobs and taking responsibility for their boards. If they cannot maintain these, then what hope do we have? We have no power and once we're infected, there's no way for us to get rid of them. Fullchan's /tech/ is having this problem right now, where there's a lot of /pol/ posters and the single volunteer is sitting on his hands despite complaints. Any action would be better than inaction.

It's only a matter of time until the barbarians come to our gates, when that happens what will we do?


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 02:45:19 [Preview] No. 11678 del
>>11674
Forums and Reddit mitigate the effect of negative responses by simplifying agreement to upvotes/likes/etc. They allow the poster to care less to how someone may react or reply to a certain post and more on how the overall group/onlookers will judge it through semi-anonymous approval ratings. If you are in a pen of pigs and they all like slosh, then slosh will be eternal.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 03:54:02 [Preview] No. 11679 del
>pushing this hard the "new age way-of-thinking"
>pushing upvotes again
Oh hey US astroturfing contractors. You are (not) welcome here.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 06:56:49 [Preview] No. 11683 del
>>11675
I use daz studio for most of the heavy lifting, 3Delight is the renderer, blender gets a workout fairly often (or gives me a workout more like), marvelous designer for clothes, gimp for textures, and sometimes found-stuff or game screenshots for backgrounds.

>>11678
I think you're right. Reddit satisfies the human desire to communicate with and obtain reassurance or acknowledgement from others, but in a way that favors and rewards clickbait.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 13:17:12 [Preview] No. 11686 del
>>11678
Upvotes are the entire reason reddit is shit. The model is inherently flawed. Stop pushing this shit.

If you actually want quality discussion, go for pseudo-anonymity as >>11596 suggested. By separating anonymous posters into (descriptive, useful, topically relevant) groups, it becomes easier to identify good and bad posters through the content and quality of their post. Flow of conversation is improved by having some form of identification with those you are engaging with. All while the useful parts of anonymity are retained.

This is the reason why country flags have been successful and proliferated on imageboards, even though it contradicts true, absolute anonymity.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 13:25:24 [Preview] No. 11687 del
>>11686
That's exactly what I would want if I had a company that tracks users: make a method for easier parsing and classification of unique users.
Don't. No more metadata should be leaked.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 17:07:07 [Preview] No. 11688 del
I think 11678's point is worth thinking about. I didn't interpret that as pushing upvotes per-se and I don't think that's the sole reason for the issues that Reddit has. Reddit's particular implementation makes a game out of getting as high a numeric score as possible regardless of content, which does seem like a problem. What I like is the general concept of finding ways to allow others to express approval for what people post if they like it.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 18:37:03 [Preview] No. 11689 del
>>11688
Anonymous emojis a la how Github and Discord do it could be an interesting experiment. To start out, they'd have absolutely no effect like Reddit has by censoring disliked comments, it'd just show you what your peers think of a certain idea or point and can be used to gauge the community and help moderators judge who should stay and who should go -- maybe. The only issue I can see manifesting is trip nonsense where they start creating personalities to farm good boy emojis, but that's optimizing before anything has even been put in place and I don't know of us having a trip problem at all right now.

At the least, it would be something new and novel to explore.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 18:57:14 [Preview] No. 11690 del
What would happen if you only had downvotes or dislikes and give normal content equal weights? An upgrade to the reporting system if you will. Dislikes (not necessarily visible) on posters would be limited on thread level. Having enough dislikes in certain thread would warrant a thread level ban. Everyone can have a bad day once in a while and gets emotional while posting, so I don't think it would be fair, to get a board level ban, if a thread caused abrupt change in poster's emotional state. If you need to deal with spammers or raids, then you simply take time window into account and issue board or global level ban. Similar system would be in place to deal with threads. Let's say someone creates a low effort thread which users decide to dislike. Taking into account number of replies and number of dislikes you can quickly determine that thread is of low quality and automod can then delete it before it can evolve to shitposting contest. I think the main problem with current system is that reporting is not convenient enough and mods can't be here all the time.

Of course, you could go further than just upgrading reporting system. By utilizing (buzzwords incoming) machine learning to assist in disliking process by decreasing amount of dislikes necessary to delete post or thread (as opposed to fixed percentage of given population of posters). Dislike threshold value could also be changed by finding similarities between previous bad threads. There is also all sorts of statistics and other parameters to explore that I can't think of right now.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 19:01:15 [Preview] No. 11691 del
>>11690
This flies against what the other poster said on positive reinforcement. If all you have downvotes, what would posters have to gain? And I believe venturing into dislikes censoring posts is a bad direction. HN and Reddit already do this to some extents.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 19:04:18 [Preview] No. 11692 del
it's all in the communication of votes. Results should only be shown to the poster and not the community. This would prevent any sociological affects of the voting and would allow machine learning and the poster collect vital data.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 19:09:35 [Preview] No. 11693 del
>>11691
maybe it should be like slashdot's option: interesting, insightful, etc. And mix in some negatives like "I disagree", "Adds nothing to conversation", and "low effort"


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 19:15:22 [Preview] No. 11694 del
>>11693
I think these would be better. Some popular forum software out there has something like this where you get to flag comments with stuff like "Informative, Uninformative, Funny, I agree, I disagree, etc."


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 19:50:05 [Preview] No. 11695 del
>>11691
There is, as you say chance for abuse to create censorship. A way to solve this would then be not deleting marked posts but hiding them instead. You can then offer user a function to further evaluate hidden content himself. To alert that something suspicious is going on you could add health bar to the thread, which would indicate ratio of hidden posts to live posts. But the whole idea is that community has to be consense on its decision by voting. That's why there would be a threshold for hiding so no one can come in from outside and wreck havoc in the community. Posters who posted and did not get their posts disliked in current thread would have slightly larger effect on dislike value of questionable post and similarly users who didn't post or have just skimmed over thread would have a lot smaller effect on dislike result. It's mostly a problem of forming correct function to evaluate if a post is bad and should be hidden. That would mostly be there to deal with baiting, shitposting, spamming and advertising. Dislike value would probably only be visible to poster just to get information that he is doing something wrong.

As for positive reinforcement >>11693 could work. What I'm afraid could happen is that rewards/penalties could get in a way of discussion. Users would be immediately attracted to marked posts and skip over other posts. Having equal chance of being heard is one of the unique features of imageboards that you can't easily get elsewhere.


Anonymous 11/06/2017 (Mon) 22:27:33 [Preview] No. 11696 del
>>11678
We don't want to silence wrong opinion however negative. We simply need to encourage more positive community involvement. This board needs to be more than a shitting ground for that to happen. I don't think reddit policing or group think are the way to achieve that.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 02:37:07 [Preview] No. 11697 del
(385.62 KB 853x480 darko.png)
>>11596
>Mandatory OS flags derived from the user agent in HTTP header.
<OS flags
>>11608
>You could also deject the visitors user agent with javascript and block windows users.
<javascript
>>11637
>Block all windows users by detecting their fonts, all tor users whose window isn't 1000x1000 and those who has javascript on.
<detecting their fonts
>What's next, you'll read all email in mutt?
<implying mutt is bad
>>11651
>I think the main problem is increased amount of negativity in general.
<"negativity"
>they are incapable of sharing positive thoughts.
<"positive thoughts"
>Stop with posts about what SJWs are doing in software, stop posting politics
<"using it's argument against their own" - rhetoric technique to confuse people
>In order to initialize shift towards more positive environment
<positive environment
>>11656
>Politics really DO ruin any semblence of rational discussion.
<assuming politics discussion is not rational
>>11658
>I had the idea of making a board to be an anti negativity experiment to see the effects of enjoyment based posting.
<anti negativity experiment
<enjoyment
>they offer the free speech and anonymity to openly shit on others without repercussion
<ignores all the other discussion on imageboards and focus on the "shit on others" part
<wants "anti negativity"
>>11674
>It is in agreement with those who believe that positive reactions are a component of keeping a board alive.
<"positive reactions"
>>11677
>non-toxic
>the text from these rectangles is coming from real people
<"real people"
>so why would you do it here?
>dissatisfaction and other negative emotions
<negative emotions
>removing everyone who isn't a "cultural fit"
<cultural fit
>contrary to some posters insistence that their way is the right way without any first hand evidence of their experiments working.
<again, another rhetoric technique to confuse people
>Forums have already proven to be safe from invaders
<"safe from invaders"
>>11678
>effect of negative responses by simplifying agreement to upvotes/likes/etc.
<negative responses
<upvotes
>>11686
>go for pseudo-anonymity
>By separating anonymous posters into (descriptive, useful, topically relevant) groups
<"having some form of identification"
>>11688
>I think 11678's point is worth thinking about.
>>11689
>Anonymous emojis a la how Github and Discord do it could be an interesting experiment.
>>11693
>maybe it should be like slashdot's option: interesting, insightful, etc. And mix in some negatives like "I disagree", "Adds nothing to conversation", and "low effort"
>>11694
>"I think these would be better."

You can't pentest us, feds. Oh, btw, what Personal Management software are you using? How much are they paying you?
We will say it to you ONE TIME: get.the.fuck.out.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 02:55:01 [Preview] No. 11698 del
(169.14 KB 2400x2400 not_informative.png)
>>11697
Are you pointing out how we all looks like feds or do are trying to bring argument against them? Because what you posted is something I'd expect from a spook: to dissuade any change from the fed-funded !FUN! plan to total destruction of all (((cyber miscreants.)))

It's probably not even the feds trying to destabilize image boards, but certain groups with illogical motives to remove all things that they do not agree with instead of doing something productive. If you had a point to make, it's completely lost because you couldn't be serious for a second and type out your thoughts in any human readable format.

This post gets a "not informative" from me.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 03:42:59 [Preview] No. 11699 del
>>11698
other anon already did it >>>/operate/7077


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 11:12:06 [Preview] No. 11700 del
<<11697
I agree with the majority of what you said. I think profiling and storing any kind of unique identifier per post is not a good thing. However, I don't agree with the notion that anybody proposing changes or wanting to improve something, even if it's from their perspective and not yours, must have a nefarious agenda. This is actually a general reply, I mostly referred to your post because you obviously care about this place and had a couple of mine in there.

My agenda is to find a place to hang that I enjoy. I write code, I try to create art and music and write some stories. Maybe it's all crap. I don't know, but I'm human and I want to share things and I crave positive feedback. I don't have facebook or twitter or deviantart or whatever because I don't appreciate being someone's product. I don't deal with cp, animal cruelty, or genuinely hateful racism or misogyny very well. (I've got some racist and misogynist in me, I'd be lying if I said I didn't.) I don't think I'm evil or a new-age thinker or a sjw or anything like that. My guess is that I'm probably more like others here than some think, and vice versa. We are here, after all.

I'm encouraged by this thread because I see people who seem to care about some of the same things I do. Imageboards are about people sharing their thoughts and ideas and this thread is about how to keep that going. My personal opinion, for what it's worth, is that more of what people want to see, more positive reinforcement of that, and less kys is basically the key. I wouldn't mind some easier way to tell people "Hell yeah! Noice!" than having to go out on a shaky, risky limb and just say it, but maybe that's what I need to put into helping to make what I'm looking for.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 13:24:22 [Preview] No. 11701 del
I've been thinking for a while and came up with new idea on how to increase overall quality of the content and consequently create more positive atmosphere. The main issue with large imageboards is that signal to noise ratio is too low. If you look at fast boards you'll notice that there are a lot of low effort useless 1 word replies, which are harder to find or are practically non existent on slow boards. Main reason being is that people don't feel as bad posting low effort content, if everyone else is doing the same. Noise just gets mixed with other noise. To remove noise from signal you need a filter.

A way to achieve better S/N ratio with imageboards, is to create multiple tiers of boards, access to which you control with some sort of authorization. At tier 0 there would be your normal unfiltered discussion. Everyone is free to post what they like with no restrictions. If the community was small enough that would be all you need. Problems start showing when people from questionable communities get involved, who often have very little in common with the original community. Without strong moderation restoring order is very difficult or even impossible. Order is brought back by tier 1 boards which are not accessible to outsiders. To get access to tier 1 board, you need approval from tier 1 users. If tier 1 users see that you are genuinely interested in sharing quality content and thoughts in tier 0 board, you get access to tier 1 boards. For medium sized communities that amount of filtering would be sufficient. If S/N ratio starts decreasing in those boards because of internal disagreements (for example linux users start attacking windows users because they use windows) you add tier 2 boards, which would similarly require approval from existing users. Such separation seems crazy when there are already very few posters, but this is meant for very large communities (if tech had 1000 posters and 300 of them were interested in windows they would begin tier 2 board to avoid causing disruptions in tier 1).

To start there would be only for example random board to avoid segmentation. Once boards get popular and post quality goes down, you add second random board which requires approval to post and view. In that way you keep original atmosphere but at the same time gain ability to filter good posters from bad posters from popular board, who you then import to tier 1 board. If tier 1 random gets too big you add other tier 1 boards with specific topics. And then if this becomes too large you move to tier 2, but I don't think that would be necessary unless community gets really large (>10000 users). For starters just adding first layer of filtering would be sufficient. I know this is creating a walled garden, but having community completely open has its disadvantages.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 13:44:18 [Preview] No. 11702 del
>>11701
redditor detected


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 13:50:48 [Preview] No. 11703 del
>>11702
Your redditor detector needs calibration. I don't use reddit.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 14:15:43 [Preview] No. 11704 del
>>11701
If everyone is anonymous, how would you identify good posters from bad? Especially Tor users. This is of course, if the administration even is willing to change anything, which after a couple of weeks of no input from them seems dubious. I'm all for discussing new things to help augment the community, but all of that is moot (heh) if the administration doesn't take an active role in it. I wouldn't want to branch off again to make another chan, but admins are just volunteers and don't seem to care too much about a single board's fate.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 14:37:58 [Preview] No. 11705 del
>>11704
Privacy is a freedom, and like all other freedoms they do come with some risks. But when you look at the whole picture, I much prefer freedom over authoritarian control.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 14:43:54 [Preview] No. 11706 del
>>11704
It depends on what kind of anonymity you require. If you want anonymity to mitigate social effects then simple token would work. If you're careful not to colerate it with personally identifiable information then it could also work for general anonymity. For making posts really impossible to track, you pass tokens between different users, so that each time user posts with different token, but of them can grant access to the board. This is mostly a technical issue, there are multiple solutions.

If administration is unwilling to participate, then we should research into automated or user-based administration.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 16:03:25 [Preview] No. 11707 del
>>11687
>>11700
>classification of unique users
>unique identifier per post

// Match user agent string with operating systems
Windows 3.11 => Win16,
Windows 95 => (Windows 95)|(Win95)|(Windows_95),
Windows 98 => (Windows 98)|(Win98),
Windows 2000 => (Windows NT 5.0)|(Windows 2000),
Windows XP => (Windows NT 5.1)|(Windows XP),
Windows Server 2003 => (Windows NT 5.2),
Windows Vista => (Windows NT 6.0),
Windows 7 => (Windows NT 6.1),
Windows 8 => (Windows NT 6.2),
Windows 10 => (Windows NT 10.0),
Windows NT 4.0 => (Windows NT 4.0)|(WinNT4.0)|(WinNT)|(Windows NT),
Windows ME => Windows ME,
Open BSD => OpenBSD,
Sun OS => SunOS,
Linux => (Linux)|(X11),
Mac OS => (Mac_PowerPC)|(Macintosh),
QNX => QNX,
BeOS => BeOS,
OS/2 => OS/2,
Search Bot=>(nuhk)|(Googlebot)|(Yammybot)|(Openbot)|(Slurp)|(MSNBot)|(Ask Jeeves/Teoma)|(ia_archiver)

Due to limited amount of flags there is inevitable pigeonholing, rendering the identifier as non-unique. Flags can be further generalized.

>>11687
>>11700
>>11705
>muh privacy
>flags are literally authoritarian control
Your browser already gives this information in every HTTP request in the header. Every website you visit already has this information.
That being said, your OS information can easily be faked. And if you really cared about privacy you'd already be using Tor, which sets your OS flag to Windows NT 6.1.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 16:08:15 [Preview] No. 11708 del
>>11707
I was feeling like mentioning user agent spoofing the first time you mentioned OS flags, because it becomes worthless as a measurement of competence when anyone can fake being anything. I already spoof my UA and plugin settings to be as close to the norm as possible anyway, so I'd show up as a Windows NT 10.0, Google Chrome, et al.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 16:28:36 [Preview] No. 11709 del
>>11708
That's part of the idea, that individual users can opt out (although the burden is entirely on the user). That does not make the idea any less functional. A foolproof, unique identifier was never the point.

It is similar to imageboard country flags successfully working while VPNs, proxies, and TOR exist as services.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 17:12:12 [Preview] No. 11712 del
>>11709
Can you restate what the purpose was for UA identifiers? I remember them being propositioned as a gauge of competence, not a stand-in for user IDs.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 17:18:10 [Preview] No. 11714 del
>>11712
There are multiple purposes with varying degrees of effectiveness, which includes as being an aid to post quality control. The best way to describe them would be to duplicate the uses and effects of country flags, an already accepted and fairly widespread addition to imageboards, but for operating systems.


Anonymous 11/07/2017 (Tue) 19:32:20 [Preview] No. 11715 del
>>11687
Thye definetly are here anon

there have been a lot of these posts lately. they want to destroy our good imageboards because we are dangerous to them.


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 06:02:39 [Preview] No. 11721 del
>>11714
It's only gonna lead to people saying "this guy doesn't have the most 'supah securr' linux distro, so obviously what he's saying must be bad". People will be judging posts less by what they actually say and instead on how obscure their linux distro is. It's actually similar to the desktop threads people seem to hate so much here, but for every post.

If someone has something interesting to show or say with regards to certain computer science algorithms, I don't want people to act retarded just because they're a windows using chrome. It's only going to drive this place to focus even more on which linux distro people are using when there's much more to /tech/ that we're not talking about.
I wouldn't have any problem with this idea if the user base didn't bitch about trivial shit like this.


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 12:36:40 [Preview] No. 11722 del
>>11721
Good thing your entire point is irrelevant because browsers don't signify what linux distro someone uses at all, only that it's linux


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 12:56:12 [Preview] No. 11723 del
This thread is seriously discussing OS flags? This idea is one of the most retarded thing I've ever seem in imageboards.


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 13:09:12 [Preview] No. 11724 del
>>11723
Ok, thank you for your contribution


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 13:57:40 [Preview] No. 11725 del
>>11724
You're welcome.


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 14:13:02 [Preview] No. 11726 del
>>11701
I agree with the idea of S/N but the teir system will probably only stagnate the community. I'm pretty sure that most of the people on endchan want to positively contribute as much as they can. The people who don't are the problem. I think a character minimum should be put in place, as to make people write more/think about what they write.
>>11723
OS flags are not going to contribute anything to this board. This doesn't give you justification to be an unhelpful faggot. Short shitty responses are the reason why chan culture as a whole is going straight to the gutter.


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 14:49:32 [Preview] No. 11727 del
>>11722
Whoops, that's true. I was being stupid.
Still, between just between you're OS and browser people can make stupid decisions.


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 15:07:14 [Preview] No. 11728 del
>>11700
>I think profiling and storing any kind of unique identifier per post is not a good thing.
>I wouldn't mind some easier way to tell people "Hell yeah! Noice!"
then just write it. no need for votes.
>>11701
>create more positive atmosphere
<positive
>To remove noise from signal you need a filter.
no, that's what lazy people do. The right thing to do is to rebuild without the sensor (in your image engeneering analogy). In this case, better users. You logic of bandwagon effect also applies to other content. If a user see more signal than noise, using your analogy, the probability of more signal being produced is higher. But, of course, you all want:
<positivity
>some sort of authorization.
<"some sort of authorization."
>which requires approval to post and view.
<approval
not even funny anymore.
>>11707
>Every website you visit already has this information
private information != public information
>your OS information can easily be faked. Yes, and that's the point.
>if you really cared about privacy you'd already be using Tor
oh, thank you, how kind of you
>>11709
>That does not make the idea any less functional
No, not less functional. Just completely useless.
>>11714
>an already accepted and fairly widespread
<no answer to the original question
<uses non-sequitur
>>11726
>people on endchan want to positively contribute
<positively
>The people who don't are the problem.
<"everyone that does not agree with me are not acting "positively""
>I think a character minimum should be put in place
<character minimum
oh, hey lainchan
>This doesn't give you justification to be an unhelpful faggot.
Oh, actually he was very helpful, since yourself just agreed with us: "OS flags are not going to contribute anything to this board".

>>11417


Anonymous 11/08/2017 (Wed) 17:11:49 [Preview] No. 11729 del
>>11728
>not even funny anymore.
Maybe my choice of words wasn't quite right for what I was trying to explain. When you have small community like here, there aren't any problems with outside influence. No one is advertising anything and there is no spillover from other boards, as potential for exploitation is too small. But if you look at 4/g/ or 8/tech/ you find subtle advertising or people from other boards claiming that this board is sub-board of some other broad. This is inevitable if everyone is allowed to post. Why wouldn't companies advertise their products in PC building threads on /g/? I don't like denying people access to knowledge, but once your community reaches certain size someone will definitely try to take advantage of it. Dealing with that problem requires some compromises. I'm trying to give some possible solutions, but they're not by any means to be taken as absolute. I'm hoping that someone will gather all ideas from this thread and come up with something that will help us in the long run.

>>11726
Minimum length is a good starting point to increase quality, but in some cases short answer is better than a long one. Maybe r9k style originality checking could also help?


Anonymous 11/13/2017 (Mon) 11:45:19 [Preview] No. 11749 del
What should be the top general discussion boards, /b, /tech, /pol and /v are barely alive with /pol being most active. This says a lot about the general tone of endchan. I think for /tech to improve we need to see increased traffic to endchan as a whole. I remember long ago a bot on /g that gave generic replies to make the board seem more active and appealing to new visitors. In addition the only way to attract NEW members is publicity. I have been thinking of asking odili if we can have a game on the endchan servers to help draw people in, possibly Minetest although that's a little out of fashion now. I know people are also attracted to releases and people do come to see the endware suite. However I can't think of anything I could release that would be worthy.


Anonymous 11/13/2017 (Mon) 15:03:37 [Preview] No. 11750 del
We need more p0rn.

Maybe a community project startup for a webcam site run entirely in bitcoin and total anonymity and privacy for the users and administrators?


Anonymous 11/14/2017 (Tue) 06:16:29 [Preview] No. 11752 del
>>11750
So, you mean like set up a really sexy makerspace pumping with techno beat, outfitted with webcams focused on hot soldering irons and sponges dripping wet and ready to wipe the tips shiny?


Anonymous 11/14/2017 (Tue) 11:20:08 [Preview] No. 11753 del
(22.21 KB 502x376 tetsuo_still.jpg)
>>11752
h-have you said pr0n?
like, hardvapour playing in a cryptoparty with red neon all over the place, while people exchange monero coin for illegal research drugs? y-yeah.


Anonymous 11/14/2017 (Tue) 15:45:03 [Preview] No. 11754 del
>>11752

No.

I was thinking more how we could alleviate and sponsor single mothers (in extant or merely potential ideals) in unfortunate circumstances, situations, and ... uh ... certain underdeveloped locations.

I'm also not suggesting such, but this guy has a certain flair for possibilities and promotion:
>>11753


Anonymous 11/16/2017 (Thu) 17:22:35 [Preview] No. 11757 del
mutters jesus h fuckin christ. shakes head. closes tab.


Anonymous 11/16/2017 (Thu) 20:05:24 [Preview] No. 11758 del
>>11575
That's how it works. Most of us are too depressed to even try.


Anonymous 11/24/2017 (Fri) 08:50:31 [Preview] No.11796 del
>>11596
You'll get about 1000 unique user agents from me. I think one of them is even GNU/Toaster.

>>11650
Chans aren't dying, it's just that Reddit keeps flooding them with their stupid bullshit. This place is mostly reddit-free. 4/g/ is unbearable as it's flooded with shills and unironic W10 or GNU/systemd users. 8/tech/ is ok for the most part.

>>11656
There's nothing wrong with discussing the political side of things as SJWs flooding free software is a major problem. Free software is being subverted as we know it. You can stick your head in the sand all you want, but eventually it will bite you in the ass.

Anyone suggesting upvotes shouldn't be using image boards in the first place.



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